The Texas Freedom Network just sent out the following press release.
THOUSANDS SEND MESSAGE TO GOV. PERRY: STOP USING FAITH AS A POLITICAL WEAPON TO DIVIDE AMERICANS
More Than 10,000 Sign Open Letter Calling on Governor to Respect All Faiths and End His Office’s Association with a Hate Group
The Texas Freedom Network today sent Gov. Rick Perry an open letter signed by more than 10,000 Texans and others who are concerned that the governor’s prayer rally in Houston this weekend is more about promoting his political career than faith.
“Gov. Perry leads a diverse state in which not everyone shares the same religious and political beliefs,” TFN President Kathy Miller said. “It’s simply wrong that he would share a stage with extremists who use faith as a political weapon to divide Americans instead of working to unite us in support of our nation.”
The governor asked the American Family Association, which the Southern Poverty Law Center calls a hate group, to organize The Response at Reliant Stadium on Saturday. Other organizers and endorsers have a history of using incendiary anti-Catholic and anti-Semitic rhetoric. Some have called Oprah Winfrey a precursor to the Antichrist and the Statue of Liberty a “demonic idol.” Another endorser, former congressional candidate Stephen Broden of Dallas, last year suggested that violent revolution might be justified if the 2010 elections didn’t bring the changes he wanted.
The open letter calls on Gov. Perry to make the Houston event “open to speakers and attendees of all faiths, as well as welcoming to people of good will who are not affiliated with a faith tradition.” It also urges him to respect the diverse beliefs of all Texans by ending the association between his office and the American Family Association.
The open letter and signatures are available here. As of 9 a.m. today, the letter included 10,410 signatures.
Gov. Perry has a long history of using faith as a political tool. The year before his 2006 re-election campaign, for example, he and his supporters in the Texas Restoration Project hosted thousands of conservative evangelical pastors and their spouses at “briefings” that promoted the governor and his policies. Lodging and food for attendees were covered by Perry campaign donors whose identities were not made public at the time. Speculation is growing that Gov. Perry will run for the Republican presidential nomination next year.
Funny thing. My Friend never did care very much for politics and power. I wonder why the Reliant Stadium crowd cherishes it so very much? I wonder if it could have something to do with fruits? Check it out:
1) Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; and saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me. Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve. (Matthew 4:10)
2) Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name. (Philippians 2:3-9)
3) And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s. And they marvelled at him. (Mark 12:17)
http://www.texasgopvote.com/continental-congress/america-s-founding-fathers-would-approve-and-attend-governor-perry-s-prayer-rall-003141
America’s Founding Fathers Would Approve, and Attend, Governor Perry’s Prayer Rally (The Response) this Saturday in Houston Texas
Texas Governor Rick Perry has been criticized by the leftist media and atheist groups for calling for a day of prayer to ask God’s help in solving the many problems we face in America today. This Prayer event is called The Response and it is this Saturday, August 6th, 2011 at the Reliant Stadium in Houston, TX. It is an all day event that starts at 9am.
These groups opposing Governor Perry’s involvement in the prayer rally use words like “separation of church and state” and they say that the Constitution forbids the government from having anything to do with something that even smells of religion or spirituality. They want to take God out of the Pledge of Allegiance and our history books. They want to prohibit prayer at private memorial services of fallen soldiers and they say that the Founding Fathers were deists.
The Atheists and the Liberal Media are wrong.
The Constitution does not mention the words church or state. The Constitution says that Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.
What that means is that Congress shall make no law creating a national religion (like the Church of England) and Congress cannot tell people that they not to freely exercise their religious beliefs, even if a politician wants to express his religious beliefs. It does not mean that spirituality should be taken out of America, nor does it mean that government officials cannot be publically spiritual. In fact, America was founded the idea that GOD has given us inalienable rights that cannot be taken away. The Founding Fathers created America on a spiritual foundation and, according to Wallbuilders, 27 of 56 Founding Fathers were pastors. Learning about our Christian Heritage, or having in God we Trust on money, or having Governor Perry call for a day of prayer, none of those amount to “Congress establishing a National Religion”, nor are they the government forcing someone to believe in a specific religion. You can believe and practice whatever religion you want in America and a cross on the side of the road is not going to prevent that. An atheist or a Muslim might not like it, but the cross on the side of the road is not establishing a national religion that everyone has to belong to, and it is not prohibiting you from believing in Allah or no God at all.
Still, Atheist and Agnostics of the Freedom From Religion Foundation sued Governor Perry to try to keep him from being involved in the Day of Prayer. U.S. District Judge Gray Miller threw out the lawsuit against Perry and said that the Freedom From Religion Foundation argued against Perry’s involvement based merely on feelings of exclusion, but did not show sufficient harm to merit the injunction they sought and that The governor has done nothing more than invite others who are willing to do so to pray.
So what would the Founding Fathers think of Rick Perry’s Prayer Rally? They would probably be there!
First of all, if God was to completely taken out of America then we would have no rights because, according to the Declaration of Independence, all people are created equal with inalienable rights given to us by our Creator (God)
Second of all, the founding fathers were deeply involved in public prayer and public religious activities, even in government, and especially while they were founding the United States of America.
What did the Founding Fathers think of Public Religious Expression?
Below is just a small list of examples of Founding Fathers and Public Religious Expression (Click Here for the Much Larger List from Wallbuilders)
One of the most famous pictures of the First Continental Congress is a picture of the founding fathers on their knees praying for God’s guidance.
Another famous picture is of George Washington on his knees praying in the woods for God’s guidance.
Thomas Jefferson
Thomas Jefferson would disagree in several areas with those who often invoke him as an authority for a secular public arena, for Jefferson himself regularly violated the bland “civil religion” standards which many secularists promote. Consider:
Jefferson urged local governments to make land available specifically for Christian purposes
In an 1803 federal Indian treaty, Jefferson willingly agreed to provide $300 to “assist the said Kaskaskia tribe in the erection of a church” and to provide “annually for seven years $100 towards the support of a Catholic priest.” He also signed three separate acts setting aside government lands for the sole use of religious groups and setting aside government lands so that Moravian missionaries might be assisted in “promoting Christianity.”
When Washington D. C. became the national capital in 1800, Congress voted that the Capitol building would also serve as a church building. President Jefferson chose to attend church each Sunday at the Capitol and even provided the service with paid government musicians to assist in its worship. Jefferson also began similar Christian services in his own Executive Branch, both at the Treasury Building and at the War Office.
Jefferson praised the use of a local courthouse as a meeting place for Christian services;
Jefferson assured a Christian religious school that it would receive “the patronage of the government”;
Jefferson proposed that the Great Seal of the United States depict a story from the Bible and include the word “God” in its motto;
While President, Jefferson closed his presidential documents with the phrase, “In the year of our Lord Christ; by the President; Thomas Jefferson.”
Furthermore, Jefferson would especially disagree with those who believe that public prayers should be non-sectarian and omit specific references to Jesus. Jefferson believed that every individual should pray according to his own beliefs. As Jefferson explained:
[The] liberty to worship our Creator in the way we think most agreeable to His will [is] a liberty deemed in other countries incompatible with good government and yet proved by our experience to be its best support. (emphasis added)
Critics, therefore, would be particularly troubled by President Jefferson’s words that:
No nation has ever existed or been governed without religion. Nor can be. The Christian religion is the best religion that has been given to man and I, as Chief Magistrate of this nation, am bound to give it the sanction of my example.
James Madison
James Madison also encouraged public officials to declare openly and publicly their Christian beliefs and testimony — as when he wrote to William Bradford (who became Attorney General under President George Washington):
I have sometimes thought there could not be a stronger testimony in favor of religion or against temporal enjoyments, even the most rational and manly, than for men who occupy the most honorable and gainful departments and [who] are rising in reputation and wealth, publicly to declare their unsatisfactoriness by becoming fervent advocates in the cause of Christ; and I wish you may give in your evidence in this way.
Additionally, throughout his Presidency, Madison issued several proclamations for public days of prayer, fasting, and thanksgiving, and like Jefferson, President Madison also attended church at the Capitol, thus publicly endorsing religion in official arenas.
So, not only did Jefferson and Madison endorse religion in the public arena, they were even willing publicly to endorse Christian prayers in the public arena rather than the bland politically-correct civic prayers desired by critics of public prayers.
There are many additional framers of our government who are also qualified to speak to the issue of religious expressions in official and political arenas. For example:
· [W]e can only depend on the all powerful influence of the Spirit of God, whose Divine aid and assistance it becomes us as a Christian people most devoutly to implore. Therefore I move that some minister of the Gospel be requested to attend this Congress every morning during the sessions in order to open the meeting with prayer. Elias Boudinot, President of Congress, A Framer of the Bill of Rights in the First Congress
See the rest of the list from Wallbuilders
What Did the Founding Fathers think about Religion and Government?
Below is a small list of a much larger list of the Religious Quotes and Activities of the Founding Fathers (Click Here for a Larger List from Wallbuilders)
George Washington
JUDGE; MEMBER OF THE CONTINENTAL CONGRESS; COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF OF THE CONTINENTAL ARMY; PRESIDENT OF THE CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION; FIRST PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES; “FATHER OF HIS COUNTRY”
You do well to wish to learn our arts and ways of life, and above all, the religion of Jesus Christ. These will make you a greater and happier people than you are.
While we are zealously performing the duties of good citizens and soldiers, we certainly ought not to be inattentive to the higher duties of religion. To the distinguished character of Patriot, it should be our highest glory to add the more distinguished character of Christian.
The blessing and protection of Heaven are at all times necessary but especially so in times of public distress and danger. The General hopes and trusts that every officer and man will endeavor to live and act as becomes a Christian soldier, defending the dearest rights and liberties of his country.
I now make it my earnest prayer that God would… most graciously be pleased to dispose us all to do justice, to love mercy, and to demean ourselves with that charity, humility, and pacific temper of the mind which were the characteristics of the Divine Author of our blessed religion.
Thomas Jefferson
SIGNER OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE; DIPLOMAT; GOVERNOR OF VIRGINIA; SECRETARY OF STATE; THIRD PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES
The doctrines of Jesus are simple, and tend all to the happiness of man.
The practice of morality being necessary for the well being of society, He [God] has taken care to impress its precepts so indelibly on our hearts that they shall not be effaced by the subtleties of our brain. We all agree in the obligation of the moral principles of Jesus and nowhere will they be found delivered in greater purity than in His discourses.
I am a Christian in the only sense in which He wished anyone to be: sincerely attached to His doctrines in preference to all others.
I am a real Christian – that is to say, a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus Christ.
John Adams
SIGNER OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE; JUDGE; DIPLOMAT; ONE OF TWO SIGNERS OF THE BILL OF RIGHTS; SECOND PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES
The general principles on which the fathers achieved independence were the general principles of Christianity. I will avow that I then believed, and now believe, that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable as the existence and attributes of God.
John Quincy Adams
SIXTH PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES; DIPLOMAT; SECRETARY OF STATE; U. S. SENATOR; U. S. REPRESENTATIVE; “OLD MAN ELOQUENT”; “HELL-HOUND OF ABOLITION”
In the chain of human events, the birthday of the nation is indissolubly linked with the birthday of the Savior. The Declaration of Independence laid the cornerstone of human government upon the first precepts of Christianity.
Samuel Adams
SIGNER OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE; “FATHER OF THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION”; RATIFIER OF THE U. S. CONSTITUTION; GOVERNOR OF MASSACHUSETTS
He called on the State of Massachusetts to pray that . . .
the peaceful and glorious reign of our Divine Redeemer may be known and enjoyed throughout the whole family of mankind.
we may with one heart and voice humbly implore His gracious and free pardon through Jesus Christ, supplicating His Divine aid . . . [and] above all to cause the religion of Jesus Christ, in its true spirit, to spread far and wide till the whole earth shall be filled with His glory.
with true contrition of heart to confess their sins to God and implore forgiveness through the merits and mediation of Jesus Christ our Savior.
Josiah Bartlett
MILITARY OFFICER; SIGNER OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE; JUDGE; GOVERNOR OF NEW HAMPSHIRE
Called on the people of New Hampshire . . . to confess before God their aggravated transgressions and to implore His pardon and forgiveness through the merits and mediation of Jesus Christ . . . [t]hat the knowledge of the Gospel of Jesus Christ may be made known to all nations, pure and undefiled religion universally prevail, and the earth be fill with the glory of the Lord.
Elias Boudinot
PRESIDENT OF CONGRESS; SIGNED THE PEACE TREATY TO END THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION; FIRST ATTORNEY ADMITTED TO THE U. S. SUPREME COURT BAR; FRAMER OF THE BILL OF RIGHTS; DIRECTOR OF THE U. S. MINT
Let us enter on this important business under the idea that we are Christians on whom the eyes of the world are now turned… [L]et us earnestly call and beseech Him, for Christ’s sake, to preside in our councils. . . . We can only depend on the all powerful influence of the Spirit of God, Whose Divine aid and assistance it becomes us as a Christian people most devoutly to implore. Therefore I move that some minister of the Gospel be requested to attend this Congress every morning . . . in order to open the meeting with prayer.
Jacob Broom
LEGISLATOR; SIGNER OF THE CONSTITUTION
A letter to his son, James, attending Princeton University:
I flatter myself you will be what I wish, but don’t be so much flatterer as to relax of your application – don’t forget to be a Christian. I have said much to you on this head, and I hope an indelible impression is made.
Charles Carroll
SIGNER OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE; SELECTED AS DELEGATE TO THE CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION; FRAMER OF THE BILL OF RIGHTS; U. S. SENATOR
Grateful to Almighty God for the blessings which, through Jesus Christ Our Lord, He had conferred on my beloved country in her emancipation and on myself in permitting me, under circumstances of mercy, to live to the age of 89 years, and to survive the fiftieth year of independence, adopted by Congress on the 4th of July 1776, which I originally subscribed on the 2d day of August of the same year and of which I am now the last surviving signer.
Congress, 1854
The great, vital, and conservative element in our system is the belief of our people in the pure doctrines and the divine truths of the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
Congress, U. S. House Judiciary Committee, 1854
Had the people, during the Revolution, had a suspicion of any attempt to war against Christianity, that Revolution would have been strangled in its cradle… In this age, there can be no substitute for Christianity… That was the religion of the founders of the republic and they expected it to remain the religion of their descendants.
John Dickinson
SIGNER OF THE CONSTITUTION; GOVERNOR OF PENNSYLVANIA; GOVERNOR OF DELAWARE; GENERAL IN THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION
[Governments] could not give the rights essential to happiness… We claim them from a higher source: from the King of kings, and Lord of all the earth.
Benjamin Franklin
SIGNER OF THE DECLARATION; DIPLOMAT; PRINTER; SCIENTIST; SIGNER OF THE CONSTITUTION; GOVERNOR OF PENNSYLVANIA
As to Jesus of Nazareth, my opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the system of morals and His religion as He left them to us, the best the world ever saw or is likely to see.
John Hancock
SIGNER OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE; PRESIDENT OF CONGRESS; REVOLUTIONARY GENERAL; GOVERNOR OF MASSACHUSETTS
He called on the entire state to pray “that universal happiness may be established in the world [and] that all may bow to the scepter of our Lord Jesus Christ, and the whole earth be filled with His glory.”
Patrick Henry
REVOLUTIONARY GENERAL; LEGISLATOR; “THE VOICE OF LIBERTY”; RATIFIER OF THE U. S. CONSTITUTION; GOVERNOR OF VIRGINIA
The great pillars of all government and of social life [are] virtue, morality, and religion. This is the armor, my friend, and this alone, that renders us invincible.
Samuel Huntington
SIGNER OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE; PRESIDENT OF CONGRESS; JUDGE; GOVERNOR OF CONNECTICUT
It becomes a people publicly to acknowledge the over-ruling hand of Divine Providence and their dependence upon the Supreme Being as their Creator and Merciful Preserver . . . and with becoming humility and sincere repentance to supplicate the pardon that we may obtain forgiveness through the merits and mediation of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
I recommend a general and public return of praise and thanksgiving to Him from whose goodness these blessings descend. The most effectual means of securing the continuance of our civil and religious liberties is always to remember with reverence and gratitude the source from which they flow.
Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers, and it is the duty as well as the privilege and interest of our Christian nation, to select and prefer Christians for their rulers.
Francis Scott Key
U. S. ATTORNEY FOR THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA; AUTHOR OF THE “STAR SPANGLED BANNER”
[M]ay I always hear that you are following the guidance of that blessed Spirit that will lead you into all truth, leaning on that Almighty arm that has been extended to deliver you, trusting only in the only Savior, and going on in your way to Him rejoicing.
Gouverneur Morris
REVOLUTIONARY OFFICER; MEMBER OF THE CONTINENTAL CONGRESS; SIGNER OF THE CONSTITUTION; “PENMAN OF THE CONSTITUTION”; DIPLOMAT; U. S. SENATOR
There must be religion. When that ligament is torn, society is disjointed and its members perish… [T]he most important of all lessons is the denunciation of ruin to every state that rejects the precepts of religion.
Your good morals in the army give me sincere pleasure as it hath long been my fixed opinion that virtue and religion are the great sources of human happiness. More especially is it necessary in your profession firmly to rely upon the God of Battles for His guardianship and protection in the dreadful hour of trial. But of all these things you will and I hope in the merciful Lord.
Jedidiah Morse
HISTORIAN OF THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION; EDUCATOR; “FATHER OF AMERICAN GEOGRAPHY”; APPOINTED BY SECRETARY OF STATE TO DOCUMENT CONDITION OF INDIAN AFFAIRS
To the kindly influence of Christianity we owe that degree of civil freedom and political and social happiness which mankind now enjoys. All efforts made to destroy the foundations of our Holy Religion ultimately tend to the subversion also of our political freedom and happiness. In proportion as the genuine effects of Christianity are diminished in any nation… in the same proportion will the people of that nation recede from the blessings of genuine freedom… Whenever the pillars of Christianity shall be overthrown, our present republican forms of government – and all the blessings which flow from them – must fall with them.
James Otis
LEADER OF THE SONS OF LIBERTY; ATTORNEY & JURIST; MENTOR OF JOHN HANCOCK AND SAMUEL ADAMS
Has [government] any solid foundation? Any chief cornerstone?… I think it has an everlasting foundation in the unchangeable will of God… The sum of my argument is that civil government is of God.
Benjamin Rush
SIGNER OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE; SURGEON GENERAL OF THE CONTINENTAL ARMY; RATIFIER OF THE U. S. CONSTITUTION; “FATHER OF AMERICAN MEDICINE”; TREASURER OF THE U. S. MINT; “FATHER OF PUBLIC SCHOOLS UNDER THE CONSTITUTION”
The Gospel of Jesus Christ prescribes the wisest rules for just conduct in every situation of life. Happy they who are enabled to obey them in all situations! . . . My only hope of salvation is in the infinite tran¬scendent love of God manifested to the world by the death of His Son upon the Cross. Noth¬ing but His blood will wash away my sins [Acts 22:16]. I rely exclusively upon it. Come, Lord Jesus! Come quickly! [Revelation 22:20]
I do not believe that the Constitution was the offspring of inspiration, but I am as satisfied that it is as much the work of a Divine Providence as any of the miracles recorded in the Old and New Testament.
By renouncing the Bible, philosophers swing from their moorings upon all moral subjects… It is the only correct map of the human heart that ever has been published.
[T]he greatest discoveries in science have been made by Christian philosophers and . . . there is the most knowledge in those countries where there is the most Christianity.
[T]he only means of establishing and perpetuating our republican forms of government is the universal education of our youth in the principles of Christianity by means of the Bible.
The great enemy of the salvation of man, in my opinion, never invented a more effective means of limiting Christianity from the world than by persuading mankind that it was improper to read the Bible at schools.
[C]hristianity is the only true and perfect religion; and… in proportion as mankind adopt its principles and obey its precepts, they will be wise and happy.
The Bible contains more knowledge necessary to man in his present state than any other book in the world.
The Bible, when not read in schools, is seldom read in any subsequent period of life… [T]he Bible… should be read in our schools in preference to all other books because it contains the greatest portion of that kind of knowledge which is calculated to produce private and public happiness.
Joseph Story
U. S. CONGRESSMAN; “FATHER OF AMERICAN JURISPRUDENCE”; U. S. SUPREME COURT JUSTICE APPOINTED BY PRESIDENT JAMES MADISON
One of the beautiful boasts of our municipal jurisprudence is that Christianity is a part of the Common Law. There never has been a period in which the Common Law did not recognize Christianity as lying at its foundations.
I verily believe that Christianity is necessary to support a civil society and shall ever attend to its institutions and acknowledge its precepts as the pure and natural sources of private and social happiness
Thomson
SECRETARY OF THE CONTINENTAL CONGRESS; DESIGNER OF THE GREAT SEAL OF THE UNITED STATES; ALONG WITH JOHN HANCOCK, THOMSON WAS ONE OF ONLY TWO FOUNDERS TO SIGN THE INITIAL DRAFT OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE APPROVED BY CONGRESS
I am a Christian. I believe only in the Scriptures, and in Jesus Christ my Savior.
Jonathan Trumbull
JUDGE; LEGISLATOR; GOVERNOR OF CONNECTICUT; CONFIDANT OF GEORGE WASHINGTON AND CALLED “BROTHER JONATHAN” BY HIM
He called on the State of Connecticut to pray that . . .
God would graciously pour out His Spirit upon us and make the blessed Gospel in His hand effectual to a thorough reformation and general revival of the holy and peaceful religion of Jesus Christ.
Daniel Webster
U. S. SENATOR; SECRETARY OF STATE; “DEFENDER OF THE CONSTITUTION”
[T]he Christian religion – its general principles – must ever be regarded among us as the foundation of civil society.
Whatever makes men good Christians, makes them good citizens.
[T]o the free and universal reading of the Bible… men [are] much indebted for right views of civil liberty.
The Bible is a book… which teaches man his own individual responsibility, his own dignity, and his equality with his fellow man.
Noah Webster
REVOLUTIONARY SOLDIER; JUDGE; LEGISLATOR; EDUCATOR; “SCHOOLMASTER TO AMERICA”
[T]he religion which has introduced civil liberty is the religion of Christ and His apostles… This is genuine Christianity and to this we owe our free constitutions of government.
The moral principles and precepts found in the Scriptures ought to form the basis of all our civil constitutions and laws.
All the… evils which men suffer from vice, crime, ambition, injustice, oppression, slavery and war, proceed from their despising or neglecting the precepts contained in the Bible.
[O]ur citizens should early understand that the genuine source of correct republican principles is the Bible, particularly the New Testament, or the Christian religion.
[T]he Christian religion is the most important and one of the first things in which all children under a free government ought to be instructed. No truth is more evident than that the Christian religion must be the basis of any government intended to secure the rights and privileges of a free people.
The Bible is the chief moral cause of all that is good and the best corrector of all that is evil in human society – the best book for regulating the temporal concerns of men.
[T]he Christian religion… is the basis, or rather the source, of all genuine freedom in government… I am persuaded that no civil government of a republican form can exist and be durable in which the principles of Christianity have not a controlling influence.
See the rest of the list from Wallbuilders
John,
Somehow we doubt that many of the Founders would have attended an event organized by extremists who think the Statue of Liberty is a “demonic idol,” that Oprah Winfrey is “Harlot Babylon” and the precursor to the Antichrist, that Hitler actually helped the Jews by leading them to found Israel, that God willfully destroyed an American city, and… well, most of us get the point. The issue isn’t whether Gov. Perry has a right to pray or even call on others to pray. The Constitution guarantees that right to everyone. The question is whether the governor is misusing faith to promote his own political career and, even worse, doing so with the help of hate groups and extremists. Sadly, the answer appears to be pretty clearly a “yes.”
I am in shock. I have lived in Texas for almost 50 years. Owned a business with my husband. Was active in charities that help others not so fortunate, regardless of religion. Was under the impression that there is one
God who does not discriminate. You obviously pray to someone else who is more exclusive.
John, your long cut-and-paste is riddled with logical fallacies, factual inaccuracies, distortions, and lies—way more than anyone would have the energy to refute (which is probably why you pasted such a large bunch of BS to begin with). If I can point out three logical fallacies, factual inaccuracies, distortions, or lies, will you agree that you are at least partially ignorant and that you shouldn’t have pasted that screed on this page?
Heck, John, the easiest thing for me to do would be to tell you to read LIARS FOR JESUS by Chris Rodda. She identifies David Barton’s incessant lies and backs it up with evidence. He is the king of the liars. Don’t know how the guy sleeps at night.
You could also do a simple Google search for “david barton lies” and I’m sure you could find a regular goldmine of legitimate and well-documented information about his dishonesty.
But you won’t do that, will you?
Oh, poor John. He’s a TeaPubliCANT. That means that he thinks that what he says is the absolute truth. Well, John, when the Governor of a state that is filled to overflowing decides to eliminate millions of his constituents from his “Christian” only thing. What Christians do not care to know about is that praying in public was prohibited by Jesus himself. Where? Got to Matthew 6:6 and then SHUT UP. My God does not have ADD; yours does. Else why would you continually think that you had to say “father, god, lord, god, father” over and over and over again. I am in NO way a Christian of any flavor. There is no such thing as a “Christian.” There are all kind of denominations that have split off of other churches over a tiny bit of scripture.
You talk about G. Washington and others that prayed. SO BLOODY WHAT? Only Christians pray? Only funny-mentalists like you pray? You do not know American history nor the religions of the Founders. Are you at all aware that many of the Founders were NOT Christians? They were Deists, not Christians and certainly not Trinitarians.
I have nothing against Christians, I’ve got a LOT against Christianity. Most of my angst about Christianity is how they disrespect Holy Scriptures. They try to prove their particular beliefs by lifting a word or phrase to “prove their point.” BUT IT DOESN’T WORK THAT WAY. If it did, I could prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that there is no God. Psalm 14 SAYS that right in verse one. By doing what Christianity does to scriptures is abominable.
I’ll leave you with this, John, I upped my attitude…up yours!
John is right about one thing: The phrase “separation of church and state” is not in the constitution. But I would argue that the CONCEPT is in the constitution.
You want to know another phrase that is not in the constitution? “States’ rights”.
John Cook;
Thank you for your message. As a fellow Christian, I have to tell you lovingly and honestly that you have been swindled by a pack of lies, truth distortions, deceit, and propaganda from people who are using Jesus Christ as a cheap tool to make the “things of this world” their own—and they do lust after them mightily. They depend upon you and people like you to blindly follow them and do whatever they will that you do on a given day. Most of all, they demand that you never question anything that they say or do and insist that questioning them and their authority is tantamount to questioning God himself. The last time I looked, God was still God—and they were not him. They are fallible and sinful men as all men are, and no man in this world should be trusted without questioning, examining, and testing the things that he claims. I am a professional archaeologist who does historical research in the course of my work. I want to show you just one example of how those you follow—who claim to follow Jesus—have lied to you.
You said the following:
“The Founding Fathers created America on a spiritual foundation and, according to Wallbuilders, 27 of 56 Founding Fathers were pastors.”
This is not true. Wallbuilders has lied to you. They have not made a historical mistake. They have lied to you, and they have been caught publicly perpetuating this particular lie over and over and over again—even though thy have been called on it publicly many times. Deceit is a form of lying. You will recall that Satan himself is referred to in the Bible as “The Great Deceiver.” He is also called the “Father of Lies.” As a brother in Christ, please allow me to show you specifically how these so-called Christians have deceived you.
In his presentations at churches, David Barton of Wallbuilders cleverly uses the word “seminary” to deceive his audiences into thinking that 29 signers of the Declaration of Independence had theology degrees and were ministers of the gospel. Today, we use the word “seminary” exclusively to refer to an institution of higher education that specializes in training pastors. However, this was not always so. Languages change over time, which is why we no longer converse with words such is “thy” and “ye,” as Englishmen did in the 1600s. In the 1700s, the word “seminary” was not used exclusively for an institution of higher education that trains pastors. Instead, it was used like we use the words “college” or “university” today—to refer to any institution of higher education, regardless of what subjects they teach. The actual truth is that only four of the 56 signers of the Declaration of Independence went to college to study theology, and only two, John Witherspoon and Lyman Hall, stuck with it and became ministers. Hall was booted out of his church for a moral indiscretion and decided to become a medical doctor instead of a minister. Of the other two, one became a lawyer and the other became a merchant.” James Madison studied theology in college, but he became a lawyer and a politician.
Along with this, you need to consider one other thing that I hope will make some sense to you. David Barton and Wallbuilders have been publicly undressed as liars and deceivers in both Christian and non-Christian media outlets throughout the nation. TFN does it all of the time—because it is true. If I were being publicly accused of being a liar from sea to shining sea when I was indeed telling the truth, I would hire a great lawyer and sue all of those media outlets for liable and slander. Do you ever wonder why David Barton and Wallbuilders have never done that? One is required to take an oath and tell the truth in a court of law—or you can go to jail. The people at Wallbuilders know that every lie, half truth, and clever deception that they have ever perpetrated about American history would be dressed down and exposed for what it truly is in a court of law. As the Bible says, evil done in secret will one day be exposed and shouted from the rooftops!!!! The last place they want to be caught is in a courtroom where an opposing lawyer has a team of Ph.D.’s in American history to rip them apart limb from limb with the actual truth in front of a judge.
Think about that.
I am concerned about something. I wrote a beautiful and quite kind post for John, hit the “Post Comment” button, and it apparently disappeared into some black hole. I know you guys will think I am crazy for saying this, but (as an objective scientist) I have been closely watching this phenomenon for months now. All of my posts are not great. I will admit that. However, an occasional one is a masterpiece (as my fellow writer Ben will attest), and I usually know the ones that are by the time I finish them.
Here is what I have been noticing. It happens only with the masterpiece posts—the posts that would piss off a character like Satan to where he could no longer sleep in either night or day. Moreover, it consistently happens only at or near the end of a long post—never at the beginning or near the middle. What happens? A tree falls on a power line. A squirrel shorts out a transformer. The computer locks up. The mouse and its arrow become totally immobilized and unusable. The post disappears into some mysterious black hole after hitting the “Post Comment” button. My wireless router box suddenly loses its signal output. I could list others, but you get the point.
Being an anthropologist who has studied primitive religions, I know all about B. Malinowski and the pitfalls of making improper correlations between cause and effect. You need to trust me on that much at least. There is something really weird going on here in my home office and hereabouts, and it is operating at a consistent effectiveness level of about 80+ percent with respect to posts to TFN Insider.
Something corollary appears to be operating consistently in parallel connectedness to this phenomenon in other aspects of my life. Odd and hurtful things are happening to me out in life—much more odd than what one normally sees on the average bad day. I suppose one could assert that my posts have made God angry and that Cynthia Dunbar’s army of “screw Charles” prayer warriors have called down punishments from on high. However, that is not my sense of it. In fact, I feel as if God is still here as a loving, and to some degree a protecting, presence day-to-day. I sense that something else is in operation here—something dark, sinister, and very angry that is tired of me stomping on its sand castles and helping to tear down its plans with my big mouth (and typing fingers).
I live in a New England Saltbox McMansion on land that was previously owned by a prominent family that goes way back in local history. The most recent owning member of this family died by incineration just up the street from me—from smoking in bed—shortly before we acquired the land. The house was in really bad shape when we bought it, and the things that were wrong with it were really odd—not the typical kinds of things one would expect to have wrong with a house. Shortly after moving in, we learned that the first owner of the house had made his living by selling cemetery plots. He and his wife, who had really bad taste in wallpaper, saw this as their long-term retirement home. Apparently, either one or both of them died shortly after occupying the house. I asked my next door neighbor what those people were like, and he said, “They were mean-spirited and were two of the strangest-behaving human beings he had ever seen.”
Then I started noticing the really odd things. I would be working in a room alone and sense an invisible presence in the room with me—watching me. When my son was just 2 years old, I was having a really bad day. He did something to make me really angry and I lunged to grab him in anger and smack him. Just as I did, something invisible standing behind me grabbed me around the waist and physically pulled me back away from my son before I could hurt him. It was one of the strangest experiences I have ever had. As the years passed, I began noticing what appeared to be unusual and amorphous outlines of spectral beings that would change shape and move from one location to another in the house as I watched them—particularly at night. Then there were the “dartings.” Just as I would enter or leave a room, I would notice a trailing part of something that had darted through a doorway just as I had arrived, apparently not wanting me to see that it was there. Odd faces and body forms would present themselves temporarily as parts of solid objects, very similar to the case with Ebenezer Scrooge and his brass door knocker. Sometimes, I would startle awake in the middle of the night and see one of them as part of an object near my bed or just hovering fully formed in some grotesque shape above my bed. I broke the glass ceiling light fixture above our bed trying to hit one and make it go away one night. That event scared my wife nearly to death.
I know this sounds ridiculous. I know this sounds paranoid. I know this sounds delusional. I know this sounds schizophrenic. You will be pleased to know that I had a Ph.D. clinical psychologist friend of mine, reputed to be the best in town, check me out with a full 9 yards evaluation. None of the above—not even close to anything like those.
Something weird is happening folks—and it has something directly to do with TFN Insider, the Charles posts, and some “booger” that really dislikes my activities against the Religious Right.
Oh well, I see that the lost post finally decided to present itself as an anonymous item. I know what real world thing may have happened with that post, but all of that other stuff I said in my long post above is still accurate.
********John Cook
First of all, if God was to completely taken out of America then we would have no rights because, according to the Declaration of Independence, all people are created equal with inalienable rights given to us by our Creator (God)*******
There is no direct wording of “God’ in the declaration of independence.
Many of our founding fathers were deists. They believed in nature’s god, not the christian god.
“The Constitution does not mention the words church or state. The Constitution says that Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.”
Establishment of religion requires some kind of church. So it’s in there, implied.
Governor Perry seems to live by that ridiculous slogan “it’s my way or the highway”. My father was killed in193bu a German who thought the same way. His name was Jitler.